busted halo annual campaign
Busted Halo
audio: sirius radio show
The Busted Halo Show with Father Dave Dwyer
The Busted Halo® Show with Father Dave Dwyer
The Busted Halo® Show with Father Dave Dwyer airs Monday through Friday, from 7:00pm to 10:00pm Eastern time on Sirius XM Satellite Radio channel 129. Give us a call: 1-888-3-CATHOLIC. Go to www.siriusxm.com for subscription information. Don’t forget — Sirius XM subscribers can also listen to The Busted Halo Show On Demand.


   Subscribe to Podcast (RSS) 
January 2nd, 2013
“I Am Homosexual. Does God Love Me?”
 
facebooktwittergoogle_plusredditpinterestlinkedintumblrmailfacebooktwittergoogle_plusredditpinterestlinkedintumblrmail

Audio MP3

Download MP3

Below are excerpts from the full conversation captured in the mp3 above. Click the audio link to listen to the audio. The audio includes a moving follow-up call from a fellow listener.

Father Dave: Let’s go to Jason in Boston, Massachusetts. Hello, Jason.  Do you have a question for us?

J: Yes. I hope I don’t make anyone uncomfortable with this. I want you to know: I was raised in the Catholic Church. I had a Catholic upbringing. The thing is — I am a homosexual.  My problem is that I’m juggling keeping my family and my faith because my whole family looks down on my sexuality and they believe that it insults God himself.

FD: So, you’ve come out to your family then, Jason?

J: I’ve come out. Yes. I came out when I was 16.  There was this whole big argument about how homosexuality is wrong, is blasphemy — that I’m going to hell. I’m the scum of the universe. And so, now I’m confused about everything because I know who I am, but I don’t want to always believe that I’m insulting God and all the saints. And at the same time I don’t want to cut ties to my family. A few of my family members accept me, but the majority of them don’t.

FD: Well, Jason, I certainly hear the pain and the frustration in your voice.  This is not easy for someone who is fairly young. And particularly for many people, family is very tough.

Today a lot of media attention is focused on the gay marriage debate, which brings a lot more heat to the situation — more heat than light, meaning not shining light on the truth but boiling things over. The Catholic Church joins in the debate over how we define and how we legalize marriage among different people, and the Church indeed has a stake in defining sacramentally what a marriage is. But I think — very unfortunately, Jason — that a lot of this has trickled down to your average church-going Catholic to mean that Catholicism is incompatible with someone who has a same-sex attraction. So let me be a fairly vocal and public voice to say that is not what the Church teaches. It is not what we believe Jesus or God wants: to have anybody, regardless of who they are, to feel completely excluded from God’s love. That’s the most basic teaching of both the Old and New Testaments — that the covenant that God has with humanity is for all of humanity. God says, “Absolutely I love you, no matter who you are.”

Yet there are standards of behavior:  God in His justice can dictate how we interact with one another.  And it’s true: it would be the responsibility of the community to hold me accountable when I’m exercising a bad habit of eating too much or talking behind someone’s back.  So for the most part, Christians are coming at this from the point of view that they believe it’s the right thing to do — that we should hold one another accountable and say, “Hey, you’re not meeting up to this standard of behavior.” The problem is, Jason, when we conflate a bad choice someone makes with who they are as a person created in God’s image.

We could use the analogy that we don’t look at someone with a physical handicap — for instance a person in a wheelchair — and say, “God hates that person, or God is punishing that person.” But you know what? There’s been a time in the history of humanity when people did think that way. We now would see a distinction: God has created that person in his image and likeness, and yet they are not functioning “properly” or “normatively” in every way that God designed humans to work. But we don’t say that God hates that person or that person should be banished from the community.  I think there’s a lot of that misconception now, particularly with people of a homosexual orientation. People tend to lump together what the Church has a right to say in terms of marriage or about sexual activity outside of marriage with God hating a person.  These are not the same thing.

We’ve crossed the line when valid arguments about the definition of marriage spill over into, “therefore this person must immediately be judged or is automatically going to Hell.”  That is absolutely not the teaching of the Church or the Gospels or Jesus Our Lord.

J:  It’s refreshing when you say that ’cause I’ve been hearing the same hateful sorts of things and there’s some stuff that I agree with, and there’s stuff I find reasonable. I just don’t like being seen as some sort of monster … I’m myself. I’m who I am. I just happen to have a different sexual preference.

FD: What the Church teaches about those with that orientation — what these days we most often refer to as a “same-sex attraction” — is not that they are all damned by God, but simply that they are called to live a moral life through the virtue of chastity. In fact, we’re all called to live in chastity, whatever our station in life is. Chastity within a marriage means that the couple is not having sexual relationships with other people. Chastity for me, as a Catholic priest, means celibacy, that I don’t have a romantic or sexual relationship with any other person. The Church does not say,  “We hate gay people and want to keep gay people out of our churches.” But the Church does, in all God’s justice, hold up this standard of chastity.

Now, a lot of people will say, Jason: “How can you kind of write off a whole percentage of the population and say that they can never have sex — they can never have a loving relationship?” The way the Church looks at it is this:  there are people who, either because of how they’re born or because of something that’s happened during the course of their life, are not able to do certain things. I think most people would agree that the state has a right to tell, for instance, someone who is blind that they should not be operating a vehicle. So, the Church would say that because of whatever this is in you that is different, we don’t hate you because of who you are, but that necessarily certain actions should be restricted in your life (i.e., sexual activity). Few people would likely say, “Hey! It’s not fair that blind people can’t drive,” and I don’t mean to make it flippant or trite. But this shows that it’s reasonable to say that because of something that blind person didn’t choose — that either happened to that person or they were born with — that they are not allowed to do certain things because that wouldn’t be good for society. Now, you might say, “Well, of course I can see that. We shouldn’t be crashing cars, but…” But the Church’s theology of sexuality and marriage and relationships does, for us, make this the same sort of decision.

It’s still, I’ll admit, not an easy message to hear: that the Church says that for you, or anybody else who finds themselves with a same sex attraction, the only moral option is that of chastity. I realize how that can sound pretty limiting in terms of life or love or relationship. But I think, again, it’s that double standard. We say the same thing — that people should be chaste — to people who are heterosexual. And for whatever reason we don’t tend to have the same bias toward heterosexuals, to say hateful things. That’s the word that you used — that you’ve heard hateful things said to you by friends and family. So, for my part, as someone who represents the Church, I’m saddened about that and I’m sorry that you have experienced that.

Yet, I believe that the Church, in her wisdom, is wiser than either I can be, Jason, or you in your experience of your lifetime.  So I put trust and faith in the wisdom of our 2000-year-old Church.  And I think I heard, Jason, that you’re kind of struggling with that as well. You said, “I don’t want to get rid of my Catholic faith, but it seems like some people are pushing me to do that.”

J: Well, people do say that.  And I’m raised Catholic: this is what I’ve dedicated my life to. It’s part of my identity.

FD: So, again, I would affirm that it is still your identity, and the fact that you are struggling with it and talking about it on a Catholic radio show, says to me that God is at work in you. So, don’t listen to those voices that say that God doesn’t want a relationship with you or doesn’t love you.  Try not to let a few voices — even though they may be loud, and in your case voices that are close to you and mean a lot to you — speak out of turn for what Jesus’ voice is, for what the teaching of the Church is. And continue to try to hold these things in tension appropriately. And you may make mistakes, Jason. I make mistakes in how I hold in tension how God loves me and forgives me and the standards that he holds me to. We all do, and that’s the point: that none of us are perfect.  Be honest with yourself and your family about that but continue saying, “I’m not going to walk away from this” … because I don’t hear you wanting to do that, and plenty of people in your situation, Jason, have chosen to walk away from the Church. It doesn’t sound like that’s what you want to do. Hang in there and continue to pray to God.  Continue to learn about why the Church says what we say. Continue to hear from reasonable people — not people that say, “You’re going to Hell.” Because I can tell you right now, Jason, that is not the teaching of the Church: that because of who you are that you could go to Hell. That’s contrary to Christian theology.

J: That’s very different from what I’ve heard…

FD:  Thank you Jason for your courage to call, and as you continue to work through your Catholic faith and your sexual identity, if you have more questions, that’s why we’re here on the Catholic Channel.


The Busted Halo Show with Father Dave Dwyer is on Sirius/XM Satellite Radio, Sirius/XM 129, Monday through Friday, 7:00pm to 10:00pm EST. Give us a call with your questions and comments: 1-888-3-CATHOLIC, or at bustedhalo@thecatholicchannel.org. Go to www.siriusxm.com to get subscription information.

[Published on: September 27, 2012]



 
facebooktwittergoogle_plusredditpinterestlinkedintumblrmailfacebooktwittergoogle_plusredditpinterestlinkedintumblrmail
Please note that the editorial staff reserves the right to not post comments it deems to be inappropriate and/or malicious in nature, as well as edit comments for length, clarity and fairness.
  • Harry

    Adam – I agree with you Fr Dave tried to get around the church’s silly nuances on the subject of homosexuality – and yes he did as best he could. For me, you expressed my frustrations when I see religious dogma used to take away the rights of others in a secular society and government. A saying I often see circulated always hits home with me – especially when it comes to the question of the contract of marriage in a secular society – “If you have to make a law that hurts a number of people, just to prove your morals or faith, then you have no true morals or faith to prove.” The church is free to have its dogma and I respect that – but I do not believe the Church has the right to impose its dogma on people of a free society – people who often do not have any association with the Church, Christianity or any other religious beliefs. If people want to protect the “sanctity of marriage” then they ought to look at themselves first instead of denying another group of people common legal rights.

  • Alex

    I must say that Fr. Dave explained the Church’s teaching with exceptional love and compassion.

    So many condemn the Church for calling to chastity those with a same sex attraction.

    Do you all realize EVERY human being is called to chastity? That is- Living in a proper expression of human sexuality according to our state of life.

    Single persons are called to chastity. Married persons are called to chastity. Priests are called to chastity, for which they have chosen celibacy as their expression. Those who experience same-sex attraction are called to chastity.

    There is a complete consistency.

    As a single person, I was called to complete celibacy until marriage. Was I being discriminated against? Was there some sort or travesty because of it? No. I was calling to prepare myself for the Sacrament of Marriage as such.

    Was it sometimes difficult? Yes. Were there obstacles to overcome? Yes. Did I start some sort of movement to alter those teachings because of these challenges or difficulties? No.

    It taught me love, sacrifice and self-control which strengthened my gift of self to others in all of my relationships as well as helping me to prepare for my vocational call to the Sacrament of Marriage.

    I have great compassion for those who struggle with same-sex attraction, because I grappled with gender identity disorder when I was a teen and twenty-something. With no father around, I had no model of what holy, sacrificial love as father looked like. I give thanks for those men of integrity and sound counselors to helped me to understand myself and follow the teachings of the Church. It was their leadership that helped me work through my weakness and find who God created me to be- That is, a loving husband and father of four.

    Though not all who struggle with same sex attraction find a heterosexual identity, some do and my life is a testament to that. And, we are not going to shy away any more from sharing our story. We are tired of individuals making this a either/or debate and bashing the Church for her wise counsel in the process.

    She is correct in her teaching. God loves all. All are called to chastity, which is the right ordering of sexual expression according to God’s design. Jesus not only had something to say about marriage in Scriture(Matthew 19:5 and Mark 10:7) but he also gave us the Magisterium of the Church and Sacred Tradition to lead us. Follow her and ask for the Holy Spirit’s guidance.

    He and his Church has never let me down, and will not let you down either.

    • P.

      What is this “same-sex attraction” concept? By “same-sex attraction”, do you mean mutual respect, romantic love, and commitment between two persons of the same sex that is identical in nature to two people of the opposite sex? Stop trying to euphemize what the Magisterium is really trying to do, and that is to dehumanize and delegitimize a loving bond between two individuals who believe that their love, just like that of heterosexuals, contributes to the loving goodness that God commands us to exude.

      There’s no doubt in my mind that inside the Magisterium exists a lot of anxiety over this issue. They are on the wrong side of medical and psychological science. Just like they were on the wrong side of physical science when they excoriated Galileo, and it took them 400 passive-aggressive years to recognize it. Along the way they made a fool of themselves. I love the Catholic Church, but at the same time, I recognize that here on earth it is led by the Pope, a man and sinner, and a Magisterium, a group of men and sinners. We are all together on a journey to discover the fullness of the Word of God. We need to keep our eyes open to scripture, our ears open to science, and our souls open to the Holy Spirit. Without tapping into the utmost of our human potential, we are insulting God.

  • Joseph

    I read this article for the first time last night, however, I thought it best to fully discern my thoughts before submitting a comment. First, I would like to thank Fr. Dave for the great love and compassion that is evident in his tone and response to Jason. In today’s church, it feels as if this tone of respect of often absent from the voice of the hierarchy and others in positions of power.

    With that said, I also feel that Fr. Dave’s response and the Church’s teaching leave out an important element that is fundamental to how we have these discussions about human sexuality, particularly with regards to LGBT people. The reality is that the Church does not provide a viable relationship alternative for individuals who are gay, lesbian, bisexual, or transgender. Instead, the Church calls all LGBT people to chastity and, therefore, negates their ability to love another human being as intimately as their heterosexual counterparts. Denying someone the right to love cannot be ‘normal’ and must be viewed as a deviation from what God intended.

    In regards to homosexuality in the Bible, there are no comparable stories to our contemporary understanding of LGBT people. Specifically, all of the Biblical instances of homosexuality that are condemned are in the context of gang rape, rape, and drawing distinctions between foreign practices and those of Israel. This is starkly different from the case of a same-sex couple who are in a monogamous and committed relationship.

  • Steve Ambrusko

    Jason – you are loved by God, just as I am. I am a gay Catholic and it has been a struggle for me, too. But, I have found it in my heart, in the Bible, and with those of faith who are open to the love of God (and not the condemnations of a bunch of occasionally celibate priests) that God loves me BECAUSE of who I am. I am a person who sins, just like every other human being, and I know that God loves and God forgives, though I don’t think that my homosexuality is a sin in need of forgiveness.
    It seems as though Father Dave is basically trying to say is that God loves us all (obviously), regardless of who we are, but that gay & lesbian people must be held to a different standard and cannot enjoy the amazing possibilities of love with another person just because of Church teaching based on a few passages in the Bible written in a different culture and time.
    Even if one were to equate homosexuality with sin (which is NOT the case, even as presented by Fr. Dave), God loves us despite our sins.
    However, I find fault in saying that gay people must remain celibate in the eyes of the Church. Throughout history, including now, there are numerous instances of the “infallibility” of the Church being wrong. Faith should be absolute, but not blind, not mindless flocks doing only what they are told. Our relationship is with God, a very personal relationship, hopefully facilitated by our faith traditions.
    Let’s look at the source used for such teachings – the books of the Bible (yes, Catholics should open and read their Bibles, too!). There are passages in Leviticus that obviously address the sin of men having sex with men… along side the sin of wearing clothing of two different fabrics, eating shellfish, and many other assorted rules of “the Law”. As it states, those who follow the Law must follow the whole Law, not just a part of it. So, if you follow this, it means no more cotton/polyester blends or trips to Red Lobster. However, as the teaching in the New Testament states, we Christians are not obligated to follow the Laws of Leviticus. Thank Jesus for that! The reason for the Law for ancient Jewish people was to show their uniqueness and separateness as a people of the God of Abraham, the God of Moses. The Law helped them retain their identity despite centuries of nomadic life, exodus, and moving about the ancient world. We Christians don’t have that concern – we now have our faith in Christ to identify with. And, we have our scriptures that state that if salvation and righteousness could be achieved through only the Law, that Christ would have died for nothing.
    The other most often referenced story discussed about “homosexuality” is that of Sodom & Gomorrah (which begat the word sodomy). In this story, two men (angels in disguise) are welcomed into Lot’s home as guests – and in ancient Jewish culture, hospitality and respect for guests was held in the highest esteem. So, when the heathens of Sodom came to the house demanding that Lot turn out these guests so they could be assaulted and raped, Lot could not allow that sin… the sin of inhospitality (and even offered that his daughters be raped instead!). It has nothing to do with same-sex relationships. There is even a similar story in the Book of Judges.
    So, that brings us to the New Testament. Let’s look at the passages of the Bible where Jesus condemns same-sex relationships… oh wait, THERE ARE NONE! Jesus never condemned same-sex relationships, however, He has a great deal to say about how we should love one another and, in fact, highly condemned the kind of judgmental thoughts and behavior that often is employed to speak negatively about gays and lesbians.
    So, what DOES the New Testament say about same-sex relationships? Actually, nothing – it doesn’t reference anything about a loving respectful consenting relationship between two women or two men. However, there are a few New Testament passages about sex between males (all in the letters of Paul, none in the Gospels). Interestingly, there are no New Testament passages specifically about sex between lesbians, so they are totally off the hook! However, let’s look at these:
    In Romans 1, Paul discusses how Christians in Rome have given themselves over to pagan behaviors, including such shameful lusts as men abandoning women and committing indecent acts with other men, as well as giving glory to the images of man and beasts instead of glory to God. So, one could interpret this to condemn Christians who reject Christian teachings by turning to pagan behaviors, including men who have been in relationships with women (presumably, marriage) but turn to (extramarital) relations with other men. I can’t argue with that – married men shouldn’t cheat on their wives… period (with men or women!). However, if one is a homosexual male who has the intent on having a loving committed relationship with another man, this passage doesn’t really apply. Another conclusion is that we need to focus our glory to God, not to “worship” and focusing on the idolatry of men – so, a loving relationship between men is okay, but not the lustful promiscuity that focuses on the glory of sex over love.
    The other oft quoted very similar passage referred to is 1 Corinthians, a letter written to the early Christian community in the Greek city of Corinth, a city ripe with Greek paganism, temple prostitution, gambling, etc: “Make no mistake – the sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, the self-indulgent, sodomites, thieves, misers, drunkards, slanderers, and swindlers, none of these shall inherit the kingdom of God” [JB]. Another translation [NIV] uses the terms “sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, male prostitutes, or homosexual offenders” (an interesting translation since the word “homosexual” was not coined until the 1800′s). Looking into the original texts, the terms in question used are “malakoi” and “arsenokoitai”. Study of these words more closely refers to the practice of pederasty, sex between a dominant adult male and a passive slave boy. “Malakoi” refers to a sodomite or male prostitute (typically, male temple prostitute, common in ancient Greece), and “arsenokoitai” refers to the dominant male having sex with a submissive boy. There were other known same-sex relationships common in the ancient Greek world Paul could have referred to, but he chose to refer only to a man and his young male prostitute. Thus, again, not condemning consensual loving same-sex relationships between men, and not even referring to women at all. There is a similar passage in 1 Timothy using similar terminology, and the same argument applies.
    So, any of the teachings of the Church based on these passages are subject to interpretation. And, I do NOT accept any teachings of the hierarchy of the Church that are not Biblically based.
    I realize this was a lengthy response, but I feel it is necessary for others out there like me, and like Jason, to understand the bias of the Church’s teaching at times. But, more importantly, to heed the teachings of Christ and his Church that we are all loved. Gay, straight, bisexual, transgendered… all LOVED. And for that, I thank God.

  • ben

    I am confused, do you still insist that a man cannot love another man or a woman another woman? Where is god’s love there? Why does the church insist on barring people’s free will and let god judge them after death?

  • Mike Hardy

    From 10:00 to 12:30 on the audio – you nailed it. Very nicely done Fr. Dave.

  • Adam

    I think Fr. Dwyer did as good a job as could be expected in handling this situation. The Church’s stance on homosexuality is nuanced and silly to an absurd degree, but Fr.Dwyer attempts to refrain from judgement throughout.

    My real issue with gay marriage is this, America is not a Christian country. We have separation of Church and state. I cannot understand how establishing a law based directly on religious teaching, could ever be considered constitutional. Banning gay marriage in America because Christians disagree with it is EXACTLY the same as instituting Sharia law. Both stem from religious legal systems and neither have any place in a secular government, which is what the United States has.

    People need to stop confusing the fact that most of our leaders are Christian with thinking that we have a Christian government.

  • Markus

    BTW, referncing the comments from Elizabeth Brown – Dr. McNeill was expelled by the Jesuits in the 1980s. His teachings were too radical even for what most would consider the most liberal of all the orders.

  • http://ruthhousman.com ruth housman

    The Bible as a standard is actually there for dialogue and continuous interpretation. When God told Isaac to sacrifice his son, for example. Was it correct to follow a terrible order from a superior. We had Mylai and what happened there as a deep analogous question of ethics. We are here to interpret even such commands when they abrogate the rules of humanity and even God can be addressed and questioned. Maybe that’s the whole point of ethical morality, to use our gray matter to explore the angst of issues that tear us apart. Maybe another Isaac would have said if You require a sacrifice take me instead.

    We have Bibliical exegis and we are here to question all dogma even from God because what is apparent, A Parent, is that love takes a lot of deep work and insight and to create such suffering by denying others who they deeply feel they are is not the path that is empathy itself.

  • Joe O’Donnell

    Priests are told early on the celibacy is a “gift” that will be given them because they are priests. Gay persons are called to celibacy, but without the gift of the same that is supposed to come with the priesthood. That’s “having your cake and eating it too” for the Church. Gay persons are called to be “objectively disordered”; I always thought that came with what we used to0 call original sin; we all are objectively disordered. Why does the Church settle on gay persons? My answer is that the Church is deeply afraid, from the top down to the local bishop, to review the entire “Theology of Sex,” and see that St. Augustine, and even St. Thomas Aquinas, did not have the last word. Thank you.

    • P.

      The Church “settles” on gay persons because they provide the easiest target group without alienating the sole source of their revenue. There are so many more evils in this world that go on (and in much greater frequency) besides two adult men or two adult women loving one another: pornography and the objectification of women, no-fault divorce, divorce in general, abortion, child hunger, drug addiction, the list goes on. I was appalled that the Church spent so much money last year on unsuccessfully attempting to defeat gay marriage laws that have absolutely no bearing on the Church. Money that should be going to hungry kids, home and abroad, and to assist the poor and so forth. I still give to the Church, because I believe that (like heliocentrism) while the Magisterium likes to play the infallible game, they will eventually realize that the science and the clear evidence in front of us outweighs a couple verses that were written in allegory (or in this case, referring to a completely different practice). God’s law never is inconsistent with natural truth. God’s law IS natural truth.

  • http://ruthhousman.com ruth housman

    I want to add this, since this issue is creating rifts everywhere including Orthodox Judaism which posits the act is sinful, not the person. I deepy believe acts define us and that this diverse world has got to move towards tolerance of people whos ways of making love, whose sexual choices, are not all the same. I could point out that do no harm superceeds all religious dogma and how many people have crusaded under the name of God and executed innocents for not believing as they. Look around the world. There wa The Inquisition, pogroms The Holocaust, The Armenian genocide…

    Such a hollow cost the lessons of history, if we do not learn to celebrate and love diversity.
    God created same sex love. Did you know some children are born as girls and develop male sex organs later in life? My geneticist husband told me about this. God is responsible for all of us.

    I find it most telling that those whose personal lives include contact with children who are made to suffer from what is given to them often chnge their minds.

    I abhor the way people bully others using God as their standard and it could be God is gay.

  • Tom

    No Harry you are wrong not the Catholic church and I think Father Dave Dwyer could’nt have explained it better. We don’t change the beliefs to fit our lifestyle!

  • Elizabeth Brown

    Jason, God loves you without qualification. Always remember that. Get yourself to Dignity. It is appalling to hear Fr. Dwyer tell you you have to live a life of chastity, although he obviously has to. You can live with a partner in a loving and sexual relationship. It is not true that the Bible is against homosexuality; Jesus actually says nothing about it. You might want to read Fr. John McNeill’s books, and John Boswell’s Christianity, Social Tolerance, and Homosexuality for historical context.
    Good luck, and God bless, and Get to Dignity/Boston.

  • http://ruthhousman.com ruth housman

    There is this phrase ‘Be fruitful & multiply” and fruit is a commonly used term for same sex attractions. Not only do I experience MASSIVE synchronicity through a story this same God must have scripted but I am also gifted a story about How in the Beginning Was The Word in a refreshing new way, hop scotching across Babel which means Gate in Sanskrit.

    Be assured YOU are beloved of God.

    Anyone who doubts me should read the abridged part of my Diary, The Hay Library, The Mel Yken Collection of Letters, Brown University, Providence, MA

    as Providence is to fate and Rhode Island to the winding road we all travel, we are in this together.

    in truth/ruth

    • Chris

      this is my two cents..

      Back in the day Jesus ate with tax collectors and sinners, now that doesn’t sound like much too the average person today, but these tax collectors weren’t your average joe smo that we see today.

      They were outcasts, these tax collectors where the scum of the jewish people back then, what i mean is that they were collecting taxes for the roman government from there own people the jews. From what i have heard through various teachings, is that back in the day these tax collectors were marked and there names where read out at the synagogues by the priests they were considered unredeemable by God
      since they forsook their own people and covenant.

      Now from what i have been taught is that many of these tax collectors had money, but were pretty much isolated, lonely people. In other words they sold themselves, their integrity, their nation, their God for money..

      But then came Jesus of Nazareth who ate with these outcasts, to eat with these people back then was considered a sign of friendship. Even John the Baptist sent his own disciples to enquire if Jesus was really who he says he was, for the simple reason was that he was doing things that most people with at least some sort of religious background would question. for example being a friend to tax collectors and sinners (THE UNREDEEMABLE). look this up yourself ” Mathew chapter 11″

      When i see a gay or lesbian person, i see a tax collector the very person
      that society, and some religious groups frown on and consider unredeemable.

      These are the very people that Jesus Wants today to Befriend, Loves with a love and compassion that words cannot describe.

  • Joy

    Harry, I believe what Fr. Dave was trying to share with everyone out there is that being attracted to another of the same sex is not wrong and people should not be condemned because of their sexual orientation. However it is true that God holds people to higher standers humans tend to believe He should. Socity has made such low standards for us, and sometimes we start to believe that we can make up our own rules in life and we are not call to a higher purpose. But thankfully, God know how strong his follower can be. He doesn’t say that just because something is hard we can’t handle it. He has destined us to be his children and, like any good parent, he puts high standards because he believes in us and he knows that all of us are able to follow the laws that he makes for us if we decide to trust Him.
    That said, it is clear in the Bible that the “act” of homosexuality is against Gods teachings and against the teachings of the Catholic Church. Just as priest can’t decide that they love another human and have intercourse with them after he has vowed not to, people who are attracted to those of the same sex are also held to a high ideals and are called to celibacy. God know you are strong enough to handle it and he would never put a hurtle in front of you that you can’t handle. There are many ways to share your love with another human outside of a intimate relationship, and there are many people out there who need your love. Give it to them instead of using it in a self fulfilling manner.
    I will keep you in my prayers. God bless.

  • Julie

    Jason- God loves you and has a place for you. I encourage you to go to catholicsforequality.org to receive the support you deserve.

  • Megan

    So agree with Harry. I appreciate Father Dave’s efforts to walk the line between love and compassion for the caller and the Church’s teaching. But I hope and pray that the Church will open its eyes and heart and see that all people are called to LOVE, and that love for a person of the same sex is as valid as love between a man and a woman.

  • Dan Wilt

    So the point here is, having identified as a homosexual, it is the act of same-sex sexual relations that is what the priest is challenging from God’s perspective. Am I reading that correctly?

  • Markus

    I believed the lies told about the Church throughout the 80s, 90s, and early 00′s, and all it accomplished was seprating me from my faith. Since returning to the Church, I’ve found not only that I, asa gay man, am welcomed, but I am also loved. I’d encourage Jason to research the church’s love for us by checking into the Church’s true teachings, as Fr. Dave so properly recommended. I’d also encourage him to check into the Boston Archdiocese, and see if there is a local chapter of Courage – it’s a great support system for those of us that choose freely to live by the church’s teachings.

  • Harry

    Quite simply – the leaders of the church have it wrong. There is nothing wrong with being gay. Jason when you find someone to love share your love with that person and don’t let this idea of being celibate is the only way.

powered by the Paulists